Alternative to biscuit joiner. Do you call it a biscuit joiner or a biscuit jointer? I call it a jointer but 'joiner' seems t. Alternative to biscuit joiner

 
 Do you call it a biscuit joiner or a biscuit jointer? I call it a jointer but 'joiner' seems tAlternative to biscuit joiner  By far the simplest kind of joint, no power tools are required for

The shoe is made from solid aluminum and is designed to prevent marring of the workpiece. Advertisement. Then, set the depth and width of the biscuit joiner according to the size of the biscuit you will be using. The biscuit joiner cuts a 0. 14 Responses to “Using a Biscuit Joiner” . Joining parts together with dowels is one of the conventional tasks performed by professional tradespeople. What makes it so special is its ability to oscillate and cut a kerf at the end of the plunge cut. All Filters. Matt Hagens. I've jointed a few projects now and they worked brilliantly. Charles M. I think the dowels make a stronger joint but there are time when they are just too difficult to get lined up and/or drilled using the doweling jig. Setting the cut depth. We are going to talk about them briefly at the end of the article. Biscuits are an. . I really don't want to spend. The primary wood joining tool you should have is a biscuit joiner. The best result is the 'Schwarzkopf Blondme blonde toning biscuit' of Perfume's Club AU. W W Makita PJ7000 701W Biscuit Plate Joiner with an Ergono…. Position the biscuit joiner on the edge of the wood, aligning it with the marked joint area and the position of the biscuit slots. , Grizzly G0633, Jet JJP-12, Rojec MSP310M] or 15in planer and 6in/8in joiner. Insert the biscuits into the slots and apply glue, then join the two pieces of wood together. 1,060-piece Domino set, with five cutters and a systainer. The main advantage of the biscuit joiner is that it allows cuts to be made quickly and accurately. This DW682K Heavy-Duty Plate Joiner Kit is powered by a 6. (Common biscuit sizes are shown at left . Biscuit joiners are still very useful and I do use a Dewalt Biscuit joiner for fast edge glue ups but the method is not as effective as the Domino. Get It TONIGHT, Nov 02. To make biscuit joints, the plate joiner is used to create slots where the biscuits will fit inside. houstonjc • 9 yr. Motor Speed: 10,000 RPM, Blade Size: 4 inches, Motor Amps: 6. Alternative to Festool Domino joiner? Does anyone know of a similar tool that is less expensive? I’ve used regular dowels and the Kreg system with success but would like to step up to the domino style. VonHaus Biscuit Joiner. It has a 20-volt max power rating and comes with a free battery. Apr 2003. The slots allow for easy insertion of the biscuits and help ensure proper alignment during assembly. 75. Compare product. k. There are much better ways to join boards together. This kerf allows the user to slide in half of a mechanical “biscuit” made of. For your convenience, the fence can tilt from 0 to 135 degrees, so whether it’s outside or inside corner. Take a Quick Test for the Right Fit. 22 mm bore, 0. BEST BANG FOR THE BUCK: Wen JN8504 8. Produce accurate joints with the benchtop jointer. Inside the hole, the biscuits will expand with the moisture of the glue and as a result, the plywood will hold. Remember when your boards aligned perfectly? Create joints of all shapes and sizes with a WEN Plate. Biscuit joinery and doweling are both useful joinery methods, but a direct comparison doesn’t make that much sense: They’re good for different things. Budget Pick: Gino Development TruePower 01-0102. Makita 701W Biscuit Plate Joiner (5) $349. Model T31999 Biscuit Joiner ! We've made every effort to be exact with the instructions, specifications, drawings, and photographs of the joiner we used when writing this manual. With a compact form factor and a cutting speed of 11,000 revolutions per minute (RPM), the Ryobi -JM83K-AC. Purveyor of the Universe's finest custom rolling pins. Sears, Roebuck and Co. PSA: There is an alternative to the Festool Domino. February 22, 2023. The pocket-hole joiner creates a drilled pocket in the edge of a board that is then fastened to other. A biscuit joiner will be perfectly fine to help join up panels, but obviously cannot do floating tenons. Festool tenons are available for different projects including indoor and outdoor. 1. All-metal gearing for long life. Use a biscuit joiner to cut slots for Z-shape tabletop fasteners. 1. However, it’s important to note that biscuits may not be an alternative to traditional joinery as we know it. Add to Cart. Instead, expect to spend between $150 to $700 for a genuine alternative to make quality joints. Extremely fast rotation to set different depths for the P-System joining elements: 10, 12, 14, 15 or 18. Which is completely contrary to some other videos I see, where you see people hammering the biscuits in and pounding the two boards together after glue up with a mallet. On page 70 of Jim Tolpin's book, "Building Traditional Kitchen Cabinets" he writes, (Joining wood with compressed hardwood wafers let into slots is a viable alternative to mortis-and -tenon joinery. Inside the hole, the biscuits will expand with the moisture of the glue and as a result, the plywood will hold. You can check the current price here: (Amazon link). Like biscuits, dowels are wooden pieces that are secured with glue and halfway inserted into each board, but unlike biscuits, the dowels are cylindrical pegs rather than wooden wafers. Ideal for forming strong, reliable, edge-to-edge and miter corner joints. Cutting, gluing, slipping, and clamping the wood. As intimidating as a biscuit joiner may seem, it’s one of the best options for getting a seamless joint. Best Cordless Biscuit Joiner: Makita XJP03Z. Biscuit Joiners. . March 24, 2023. 5 amperage motor that can deliver up to 10,000 RPM. ADD TO CART. Katy, TX. FYI in case anyone is interested, Lowes is clearancing the JS100 right now. DETAILBISCUITJOINER315. If the line still shows, use the turret on the side of the joiner to adjust the depth slightly deeper. While not technically a biscuit joiner, the concept and process are very similar. They’re particularly useful when joining miter joints, which can be weak and difficult to align with just glue alone. 0. The 4"-diameter blade that's standard on most biscuit joiners is great for the typical #0, #10 and #20 biscuits. Produces fast, strong joints for furniture and shelving construction. Indexing pins for alignment. Repeat for each line drawn on each board. 6 pounds. Makita PJ7000 240V Biscuit Jointer Supplied in a Carry Case, Blue, SMALL. Lay your biscuit joiner flat on the workpiece and align the center mark on the machine with the pencil line you marked across both workpieces. A biscuit joiner or biscuit jointer (or sometimes plate joiner) is a woodworking tool used to join two pieces of wood together. Perfect for edge-joining panels, aligning boards, strengthening joints, and more. The biscuits can be very useful for joining legs that have a slight twist as well as frames that are too wide for an under-pinner. It is recommended to mark the positions on both the face and edge of the boards to facilitate alignment. It features a 4-inch diameter blade that spins at 10,000 RPM and is powered by an 8. Pre-set stops easily create slots for standard #0, #10, and #20 biscuits, or can be manually adjusted for biscuits of. Carpentry, Cabinetry and Interior Woodworking - Substitute for Biscuit Joiner - I have project plans that call for quite a bit of biscuit joints. fence that allows for a lot of control of. Ships from and sold by Amazon. 24011 posts · Joined 2007. dutchbinger. Another advantage is that biscuit joiners are easy to use - they require less clamping for a strong, lasting joint. Last one. Biscuit Joiner Basics | Woodworking BasicsIn this video I want to present you a tool that can speed up your workflow and help out in many glue ups, making th. dgale wrote:I haven't used biscuit joiners a ton but seems they are much quicker then the joining options you mentioned and as I mentioned above, the slots are cut oversize lengthwise on each piece for the biscuit, so you have the ability to shift pieces laterally a bit as you glue them, so an easier and more efficient means to accurately join. In Stock. An alternative to biscuits, splines are narrow strips of wood inserted into slots cut in the surface of a butt. 5 amps, Biscuit Size: #0, #10, #20, Weight: 6. Add Tip Ask Question Comment Download. Posts. Here are a few alternatives to consider: Dowel Jig: A dowel jig is a tool that helps you create strong joints by drilling holes into the wood and inserting dowels. Now, layout the boards apart, cut a slot at each mark using the biscuit joiner, and center the cuts following the marks. Woodworkers. Dovetail joints are beautiful and strong, but not always practical. FREE SHIPPING. The biscuit joiner is an excellent tool for creating strong, invisible joints. The biscuit process allows some leeway in aligning the pieces of wood, so perfect alignment is unnecessary. This VonHaus biscuit joiner is one of the most cost-effective versions in the market. Stick the board’s end over the edge of your bench so that the fence, not the tool’s base, sets the slot depth. Base plate is flush on the sides for efficient positioning of the machine on the work piece. We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. 75 with Mail-In Rebate. but it calls for biscuits. W W DeWalt DW682K-XE 600W Heavy Duty Biscuit Jointer M…. Many people begin with a biscuit joiner when they’re starting out. B07L6TMCP2. 75 with Mail-In Rebate. Have any questions about our repair and spare parts. The biscuit jointer isn’t the tool that creates the biscuits or wooden chips. I often use a full length spline when adding a solid wood edge to plywood, typically a 1/4" or 1/8" spline about 3/8" deep on each side. One disadvantage to making biscuit joints is they typically require a specific tool called a biscuit plate joiner. If you are looking for a stand-alone, handheld power tool that allows you to cut similar joinery into wood, I have only found one low-cost alternative. The short answer is probably not. Biscuits joiners have little lateral strength, unlike the Domino joiners which are longer and heavier. STL246: The mighty biscuit joiner vs. Cubitron 3M Xtract Net Disc 710W, 240+, 5 in, Die 500X, Pack of 50 Hook and Loop Sanding Discs, Virtually Dust-Free, Premium Option for Metal, Wood, Composites, Stock Removal, and Fine Finishing. "A good choice for occasional use". It has the capability of cutting angles from 0 degree to 135 degree with positive stops at 0 degree , 45 degree , 90 degree and 135 degree . 24 inches. Clamp the side and shelf together and to your bench, with the edges flush to each other. When using a biscuit joiner, what thickness of wood is ideal? In most cases, the slot must be positioned dead center in the piece of wood. Report. Bowed panels can be a thing of the past. 1 Best Biscuit Joiner & Domino Joiner. Ensure that the blade of the biscuit joiner lines up with the marked cutting line. Rockler offers both universal attachments and those designed specifically for use with joiner machines we sell. 6 pre-set cutting depths with one touch stops for 0, 10, 20 and most common biscuit sizes. 5 amp, 10,000 RPM motor that provides power for working in the hardest woods. Keep about 4” to 6” between the center marks depending on the size biscuits being used. By far the simplest kind of joint, no power tools are required for. Dust extractable design provides clean mortise holes for better glue adhesion and longer cutter life. In the above photo on the right, notice the red line. where the only other feasible joint would be. 1400 posts · Joined 2011. Next, insert the biscuits into one of the pieces and then join the two together. Remember when your boards aligned perfectly? Create joints of all shapes and sizes with a WEN Plate and Biscuit Joiner. 0 Wood (30 Pcs) No. It is occasionally utilized to substitute mortise and tenon joints with biscuit joints when working with solid wood since they are less complicated to construct and almost as durable. Biscuit joiners are a popular tool used in woodworking to join two pieces of wood together. The biscuit joiner cutter is shallower than the domino limiting the lateral strength compared to Festool Domino. Biscuit joiners can cost more than 3 times that. Of course, the Mafell biscuit joiner is still a free machine and may be plotting even now to secrete itself. Equipped with 5. 1. Granted, those videos also point out concerns such as 'biscuit telegraphing' where the tight biscuit can project to the surface if the slot is too close to the top. Step 4: Glue and insert biscuits. The device cuts matching slots (disc-shaped) in wood, and allows two parts to be joined through oval-shaped wood discs. 6 AMP motor delivers 11,000 RPM for quick, precise cutting in a variety of woods. This powerful motor spins up to 10,000 at max rpm; meaning even the hardest of woods can be cut with ease. They won’t be. Biscuit Joiners available online and in-store at Total Tools. By the late 1960s, Steiner had improved on that design with the release of the first portable plate joiner, now more commonly known as a biscuit joiner. Position the boards exactly how they’ll be joined, then use a square and pencil to mark the biscuit positions. The depth of the cut goes as low as 1/8th of an inch and the power is undeniable. Forum; Woodworking Topics; General Woodworking and Power Tools; Need info on who makes the best biscuit jointer; If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQFAQHere are a number of tips to help you on your way as you begin using biscuit joints in your projects. Instead, put away cheap alternatives like a pocket hole system (sorry, there’s no comparison) and realize that a biscuit joiner is a suitable alternative in limited situations. As their. In cabinetry applications there are alternatives to a biscuit joiner joint. However, for every other biscuit joiner application I can think of they DO add considerable strength to the joint. These will be the centerlines for the biscuit slots. 744. Remember when your boards aligned perfectly? Create joints of all shapes and sizes with a WEN Plate and Biscuit Joiner. . Similar Tools: Alternatives to the Biscuit Joiner. I wouldn’t consider a biscuit joiner anything like a domino. DEWALT Biscuit Joiner, 6. Table of Contents. Aligning the Cutting Line. But keep in mind that the biscuit joiner uses a mini saw blade to create the slot, which is pretty oval shaped in the piece that has been cut. Porter-Cable 557 7. 1. It’s an inexpensive, but tedious alternative. Take a look at these biscuit joiners’ uses: 1. The finger joint also known as the box joint is the best alternative wood joint for the Dovetail joint. 5 Makita PJ7000. 5 amp joiner gives you 10,000 RPM and can be used even on hardwood surfaces. I think you need different biscuits. Use the biscuit joiner or router to cut matching slots in each piece, being sure to keep the slots aligned. Biscuit jointers can run in price from around $55 up to nearly $200, depending on the brand and the power. Biscuit joiners have limited use cases, but this has not stopped its soaring popularity. Put the Biscuit into the Slots. 5 Amp, 10,000 RPM, Retractable 45 Degree Notch, For Depth Spots (DW682K),Yellow . The main alternative to the plate joiner is a router with a rabbet bit. This 6. Last updated: 16 Oct 2023 A biscuit joiner is a carpentry power tool for joining that you should have in your workplace if you build and construct furniture. A biscuit joiner is an excellent tool when doing edge-to-edge and miter joints. 21. majortomandjerry • 10 yr. + Trend 100pcs Beechwood Joining Biscuits Variety Pack (No. 49 x 10. 1. ⓘBiscuits joiners have little lateral strength, unlike the Domino joiners which are longer and heavier. I set my gauge to give me a two inch registration line. Nothing wrong with biscuit joiners, but they aren't the only alternative to dominoes. $181. In the case of an older model. It has a dual rack and pinion fence that keeps the blade and fence parallel at all times and the one piece fence is integral to the machine. The finger joint also known as the box joint is the best alternative wood joint for the Dovetail joint. The DF 500 weighs 7 pounds and its size is 15. A biscuit jointer allows you to create holes into the wooden pieces that you want to join. The 557 Plate Joiner Kit from Porter-Cable feature an industry leading 7 Amp motor. Makita PJ7000 Plate Joiner, Blue. My question is what would be the best type of joint to use on these pieces? I was thinking Biscuit joiner, but I don't have a Biscuit Joiner (or plate joiner). The high-precision Festool DOMINO joiner makes it very easy, efficient and quick to complete preliminary work. The domino has a larger surface than the biscuit. Biscuiting joints in narrow stock risks blowing the blade out the stock's edges, exposing the slot and biscuit. While a biscuit joiner will AT MOST go 1/2″ into each side of the wood, a domino joiner will go almost 3″ into each side (remember, 1/2″ the tenon length goes into each piece). 9A biscuit jointer with cast-aluminium base, fence and drive housing. The following are 6 of the best options you can use for your projects. Both corded and cordless models are available. Go ahead, make your index marks. I don't know where you live, but where I'm at (DC metro area), a Festool domino set will resale on CL for around 80% of the original cost so, if I'm in your shoes I'd buy a domino to use and. This involves aligning the hardwood with the plywood and cutting matching slots into both pieces using a biscuit joiner (also known as a plate joiner). 12 ways to get the best from your biscuit joiner. Dowel jigs can be used to both edge and butt join pieces of wood and can be used for assembling drawers, cabinets, bookshelves. Now, put the biscuit into the slots of a wood piece. This method is. Domino joiners are used for loose tenons, biscuit joiners are utilized for biscuit joints. I make picture frames and I want an accurate one. 1. This will tell you where to drill the coresponding hole. Cast aluminum pivot fence with three positive stops at 0°, 45° and 90°. Learn how to cut consistent slots and get reliable results from biscuit joinery. DeWalt DW682K-XE 600W Heavy Duty Biscuit Jointer…. 3) Biscuit Joiner. Find My Store. An alternative to biscuits, splines are narrow strips of wood inserted into slots cut in the surface of a butt. 5 Amp Plate Joiner. 3 Festool DF 500 Q Set (574432) 1. This tool uses a drill bit and a set of precision bushings to drill the holes needed when joining wood with dowel pins or rods. As it dries, the biscuit swells inside the slot due to moisture from the glue and secures the two sections of wood. Center the Biscuit. A biscuit joiner, which some people call a plate joiner, is a tool you can use to join two pieces of wood together. b) Cut a practice slot in scrap wood before cutting into your working piece. The key is the angled hole. Also known as a plate joiner, this woodworking tool cuts crescent-shaped holes in the opposite faces of two pieces of wood. Solution: Allow your glued-up workpieces to dry for 24 hours before machining. A stop block has to be used to keep the wood in place when cutting the biscuit slots. 5, 45, and 67. Repeat for each line drawn on each board. The DCW682 can cut #0, #10, and #20-sized biscuits and weighs 5. Pre-set stops easily create slots for standard #0, #10, and #20 biscuits, or can be manually adjusted for biscuits of. Buy on Amazon. Precise Positioning – The Festool 574432 Domino Joiner DF 500 Q Set B004SETSXE comes with the following: Cross stop, Domino DF 500 7/32 (5mm) cutter, Open ended spanner WAF8, Trim stop in a systainer. You can find options like these: A shelf hole drilling set with a systainer. This biscuit has to be around 6″ apart. A deluxe biscuit joiner. #diy #woodworking #joinery When you're searching for videos on how to use a biscuit joiner, you will see some other alternatives to these joining tools pop. That means domino joiners will be harder to justify. 80 $ 181. Pre-set stops easily create slots for standard #0, #10, and #20 biscuits, or can be manually adjusted for biscuits of. When a craftsmen starts the joiner with the blade against the wood then the jolt from the motor can cause the slot to be angled. Don't bother with a biscuit joiner. the Domino. PJ7000 has a weight of 12 pounds and the size is 7. One of the common uses of biscuit joiners is connecting timber frames together. AOBEN 8. Cutter depth adjustment with positive stops for #0, #10 and #20 biscuits. 8. It doesn’t have the. Equipped with a powerful 6. 07 of 13. Makes biscuit joining quick and easy. In particular, they are the preferred tool for joining parallel pieces of wood together as…Sorted by: 1. along their length. If you do not have access to a biscuit joiner, you may consider using a pocket-hole joiner as an alternative. It does make some joints easier. Seriously, it's a great alternative to dominos and hand-placed dowels. Last Updated: October 5, 2023. The R1 5/8", R2 3/4", and R3 1" biscuit work very well with a typical framing job. There are many different biscuit joiners available. 5 Amps Biscuit Joiner. A biscuit joiner cannot really be used for joinery - its more an alignment tool - while a domino creates mortises large enough for floating tenons to replace most traditional M&T. Metric. PC also provides a clear plastic shim plate for the flip fence that brings the blade about 3/16″ closer to the fence. 5 Amp Plate Joiner. The FAST biscuit is a #20 self-tightening, non-visible plastic snap-in connector and can be used in all wood materials. If you plan on. This specialized mini-saw cuts thin slots in the edges of stock to hold a. Joiners are perfect for lining up wood edging pieces with plywood panels, and the biscuit provides registration between the parts, deducing the risk that you'll sand. As such, a biscuit joiner is an impressive tool for building wooden frames. The process for making a T-joint begins with marking on the edge of the sides where the top of the shelf should be. Here’s why: – Biscuits slots can be a little tight or a little loose, depending on your machine and how steady your hand is. Personally, I prefer the Dewalt biscuit jointer. 5 amp motor. Durability – A biscuit joiner should be capable of heavy-duty work without breaking down or suffering from inconsistency issues. Biscuit Joiner From a Grinder: For the first time I recently needed to make some wood joints with biscuits. Free shipping. 5 x 11. As such, a biscuit joiner is an impressive tool for building wooden frames. I use a biscuit joiner on mo. Strength and Quality. 1,060-piece Domino set, with five cutters and a systainer. In most cases, best domino joiners will be a lot more expensive than best biscuit joiners. You press it on the workpiece, make a cut, and fill the cut with a specified shape of biscuit to form the joint. The edge of one board of each joint should also have glue along its entire length. Festool DF500Q - Best Professional Biscuit Joiner. Shop Biscuit Jointers online or in-store for the biggest range at the best. Biscuit joiners are still very useful and I do use a Dewalt Biscuit joiner for fast edge glue ups but the method is not as effective as the Domino. Limit the cutting depth to no more than two-thirds of the apron's thickness. A possible alternative is the so-called “biscuit joint”, which requires a biscuit joiner. Mark your reference edges. (c) Chris Baylor. DEWALT. Lamello make the best machines (I use a Lamello C2) but other ones such as the Makita are reputed to be very good - Rob. Biscuit Joiner Reviews. adjustable integral one-piece fence can go from 0 to 90 degrees. A biscuit joiner will have a circular blade – it’s essentially the same blade. Product Details. ”. Biscuit Joinery . But if all you'll ever make is this box, dowels will definitely be your cheapest and easiest option, especially as they don't need to take any force. A biscuit joiner offers a quick and strong alternative to floating-tenon joints and doweled joints. They are strong, easy to make, and can be. Biscuit joints can be cut quickly, and make pieces easy to align without mechanical fasteners. Remember when your boards aligned perfectly? Create joints of all shapes and sizes with a WEN Plate and Biscuit Joiner. ” To make this offset joint on 3/4-in. Fill the slot about one fourth full of a good quality wood glue. However, if you plan on using it less or aren’t ready to commit to the cost of the joiner, biscuit joiners are a great alternative. The joiner has an alignment indicator mark (Photo 3) that lines up with these pencil lay-out lines. 5 pounds (tool only). Location. Don't bother with a biscuit joiner. plate joiner is essential for any woodworker. Also, its high depth limit and 12,000 rpm engine allow extended cutting control. #10: 3/4 inch by 2 1/8 inches. The biscuit adds extra surface area for the glue to bond to, creating a stronger joint. A biscuit joiner (also known as a plate joiner) cuts half-oval slots in mating workpieces; then you glue in a football-shaped "biscuit" and clamp the joint tightly. and join. It has the capability of cutting angles from 0 degree to 135 degree with positive stops at 0 degree , 45 degree , 90 degree and 135 degree . Learn how to cut consistent slots and get reliable results from biscuit joinery. Festool 574432, XL DF 700 Domino Biscuit Joiner. When connecting two. As it dries, the biscuit swells inside the slot due to moisture from the glue and secures the two sections of wood. I've jointed a few projects now and they worked brilliantly. It has a twin rack and pinion fence mechanism that ensures the fence and blade are aligned, allowing you to achieve repeatable, exact joints each time. dodgeboy77 said: Think about the suggestion. RUNNER-UP: DeWalt DW682K Plate Joiner Kit. ago. 315. Compatible with #0, #10, #20 and. . A biscuit jointer is perfect in a mitered joint to spline the two halves together, aligning them properly during clamping and strengthening the joint. Triton TDJ600 Duo Dowelling Jointer 710W, 59A. Mike Farrington joins Ben to discuss sliding tablesaws, keeping track of large projects, slow-setting glue, and whether the Domino can actually keep up with the mighty biscuit joiner! Jul 30, 2021. "A full starter pack including a graphite infused super heavy racquet, protective glasses, balls, and a clear case". However, sometimes we still make an occasional mistake. Then cut a slot that’s about 1/2 in. Best Cordless Biscuit Joiner: Makita XJP03Z. 6 pre-set cutting depths with one touch stops for 0, 10, 20 and most common biscuit sizes. biscuit doesn't go. Mark the biscuit positions on both adjoining boards as you would with a biscuit joiner. They are also precise and easy to use, making them a good option for beginners and professionals alike. It will be approx 65"L X @22"D X 23"H. I think Pocket holes and biscuit joiners are those things you use as you move through the woodworking growth; I am in the Biscuit stage and I just muddled through a mortise and tenon joint last night using a router and a table saw. 5 Makita PJ7000. I've got a toolbox I use when teaching away from my own. On/off slide switch. Biscuit Joiners in 2023. To cut a biscuit slot with a router, you generally need to make the initial plunge cut and then move the router approximately 1/2 in. A biscuit joint would provide a larger glue surface area than just a glued butt joint so it seems logical that it would be stronger. Lew- Time traveler. Hogg is licensed under CC BY-SA 2.